No interest in the drag strip at all, did at one time but faded after one trip round the road course. Beauty of the whole deal, having both to choose from.Originally Posted by NickD
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No interest in the drag strip at all, did at one time but faded after one trip round the road course. Beauty of the whole deal, having both to choose from.
Nick is thinking about making the Shelby run 11's on Quick Time Hoosier DRAG radials....
Been reading lots about various auto types and tires of choice of late. Porsche and Vette guys overwhelmingly love the NTO1s for their grip (much better than most any street tire except Michelin Sport Cup 2's), consistency and long life. The tires never heat cycle out (the R6s do after as few as 6 cycles!) and are sticky right up until the cords start showing. Additionally, they do not get greasy and overheat from sliding, unlike the Hoosiers. I can attest to this from several tire sets on my vert. The Nittos also have a much broader temperature and pressure range of operation, whereas the Hoosiers are very fussy.
Most peoples opinions from the various boards is for lapping days/driving events the NT01s reign supreme from a lot of perspectives. The Hoosiers at the right temperature and app -3 camber settings will be faster, but the question is for how long? Seems that the first heat cycle is where they are the stickiest, almost like a qualifying tire, which is beyond most people's practical understanding, tech or their ability to setup or drive at that level or consistently enough.
This would certainly include anyone reading this, with the possible exception of Fast Ed, who, in his usual humble way, will chuckle and deny any kind of speed, skill or knowledge thereof.
Having said that, an R comp is going to offer a higher performance and lap time potential - mainly due to higher braking torque and some cornering speed increase vs a sticky street tire. Real slicks are going to be another echelon higher in terms of skill required, perfect setup and ultimate care of pressures and temperatures.
JT's Shelby on R6's handily outbrakes me (on NT01s) into turns 1 and 2, in a much heavier car with similar brakes, both on race pads. I attribute that to the tires and partially to the lighter wheels. His cornering speed was also superior, but his traction out of corners was lower, probably because of the vast amount (50% more) power than my Fox.
I would guess an R6 is worth between 1 and 2 seconds a lap at TMP over a NT01, depending on a bunch of things. I would think under our lapping circumstances a similar R comp DOT "slick" would also show a similar improvement.
Everyone has different metrics and expectations on how they want to drive and what they are prepared to do.
In my opinion, the Nitto's along with full track pads and rotors yield the most lap time improvements; certainly way more than engine power or aerodynamics.
A really supportive drivers seat is also a total necessity. That's probably worth a second a lap starting at 1:30.
Back to the OP - going to 18's is going to cost ya more bread and also weigh quite a bit more at each corner. Getting a bunch of take off qualifying or race slicks from some of the teams might prove to be a money saver, but I've heard you better have a bunch of spares with you in case of duds, carcass shifts, flatspotted, overheated, hardened, etc.
Not to discount the Brembo / Cobra R style stuff, it's amazing but pales in comparison to what JT's equipped with. While I'd love to have more, combo of 4 piston Brembo's plus CarboTech pads all round have me well into the comfortable range with braking power.
On a car with little to no push, the Nitto's are an excellent tire that will reward you with quick laps times lap after lap after lap. Put those same tires on one with moderate or above push, turn to grease in short order. Once I moved to R1's, really have no complaints just wondering if there is a better mouse trap before I pop for new skinz. Upping the ante on shocks n struts all round have only added to how well the tires can really perform.
I would be curious on the specs of the pads you are running as compared to the Hawk DTC's. Do you run brake cooling? Your Cobra's weight and power output both fall neatly into the middle between the vert and the Shelby, so the three cars should offer similar ultimate lap times once the weak links are ironed out.
FRONT PADS.
Carbotech™ XP24™
XP24™ is the pinnacle compound of the extremely successful XP™ Series of compounds engineered by Carbotech™. This compound is based on the same fundamentals that exist in all other Carbotech™ formulations. XP24™ has even more initial bite, more overall bite, and more torque along with the most linear torque curve we have ever offered. The thermal characteristics are of the highest Carbotech™ offers along with one of the highest coefficient of friction ratings offered by anyone in the braking industry. This compound is the longest wearing compound Carbotech™ offers as it was originally engineered for endurance applications at the highest pro racing levels. This revolutionary new compound has been extremely successful with open wheel, closed wheel, sprint and endurance applications. XP24™ has a temperature range of 400°F to 2000°F+ (204°C to 1093°C+). Carbotech™ XP24™ is NOT recommended for use as a daily driven street pad due to possible elevated levels of dust and noise along with the necessary heat required to work properly.
REAR PADS
Carbotech™ XP10™
When Carbotech™ unleashed the XP10™ to the general public it immediately gathered multiple regional, divisional, and national championships. The XP10™ has a very strong initial bite with a coefficient of friction and rotor friendliness unmatched in the industry. Fade resistance is in excess of 1475°F (801°C). XP10™ still maintains the highly praised release, excellent modulation and rotor friendliness that have made all Carbotech™ compounds so successful. Carbotech™ XP10™ is not recommended as a daily-driven street pad due to possible elevated levels of dust and noise.
what kind of myu / coefficient of friction are they both rated at ?
Spent a good chunk of time with the owners son + engineering there coming up with the front to rear pad suggestions. Combo seems bizarre on the surface but the results I'm seeing speak for themselves. They found it amusing many of the other mfgs out there suggest same series front plus rear pads no matter the intended use. Suggestions from both EBC and Hawk fell well short of the mark although I did really like the EBC Reds as a street / track day combo and have a good number of club members running them with similar success.
agree with ya on the Reds being a good street pad, track use....well, with more self control than I can muster.
Impressive temp ratings on the fronts, but incomplete spec without friction co-efficients at the various temps.
Usually race pads will eat rotors at low temps, another reason not to run them on the street.
The front rear bias and initial bite leave for some very interesting combos. Most setups mean the rear brakes don't do enough; that's something you hear from Zeckhausen and other brake experts.
Here is an interesting article about this:
http://www.turnfast.com/tech_brakes/brakes_balancing
Not all pads are marked this way. Full-race pads may operate at high temperature ranges outside of the classification range. And some manufacturers use proprietary classifications, such as color-coding the pads or their own numbering schemes.
Friction Coefficient Code Up to 0.15 µ C Over 0.15 µ up to 0.25 µ D Over 0.25 µ up to 0.35 µ E Over 0.35 µ up to 0.45 µ F Over 0.45 µ up to 0.55 µ G Over 0.55 µ H Unclassified Z
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